Today's interview is a story about modern humor writing. I became acquainted with our interviewee when he sent me a nice Tweet about this interview I did with Brian Stack about the sketches on Conan and we exchanged messages about how much we enjoy his work. Turns out that Jeff, who is a writer and sometimes-actor on Jimmy Kimmel Live!, had a very rapid immersion into the comedy writing field thanks to a gig he got with the Onion while he was still in college and comedy videos (like "Wes Anderson Spider-Man") he made for fun. He offers lessons on putting yourself out there, taking chances, pursuing your dream and doing what you like because you never know: a few years after college you might be getting career advice from Harrison Ford. Here please enjoy the full version of the interview.

What was your career path post-graduation? I'm sure a lot of aspiring filmmakers would love to work for the Onion and then Kimmel right after college and would love to know what got you there.
I'm from this incredibly small highway town in Northern California called Montgomery Creek. There's not much there besides a post office, a cafe, and I would assume several dozen meth labs in the hills. It was something of a secluded way to grow up, but the things I had access to, I devoured... mainly comic books & comedy. I grew up wanting to go into comedy, but I had no idea how. I made little home movies with my older brother, mainly involving James Bond (portrayed by my 6 year old self) and Jurassic Park action figures.

I got into Pepperdine, which is not necessarily a comedy-focused school, but it was in Southern California, so I leapt at the opportunity to be near LA. I joined the sketch comedy show on campus and just started making stuff with my friends. Most of it was terrible, but I think that was an important step. We all need a stage of making terrible things. (I'm still probably in that stage)

The Onion job came completely by... I'm not sure--chance? I was doing my first, rather depressing, summer internship in LA, but I would check The Onion every lunch break. I've always seen it as the purest form of comedy around. It's sharp, uncompromising, dark, and always on point. And one day, after getting coffees and doing unending script coverage for terrible pilots, I sat down and started writing a fake Onion article. It was therapeutic. I found a contact e-mail address at the bottom of the website and sent it in. I quickly got an automated response saying that the Onion does not accept unsolicited material.

But I guess... someone read it? I'm not sure, but a few days later, I received an e-mail telling me to submit 10 more ideas to apply for a position as a "Contributing Writer" for the Onion News Network, their webseries.

A few months later, I got the job. I wrote from my college dorm, pitching ideas for the ONN webseries, and eventually the Onion Sportsdome on Comedy Central, and the ONN show on IFC. Biggest thrill of my life up to that point. After the Onion took a chance on me, I felt like I could actually get a career in comedy. I got more serious about my sketches going into Junior year. I changed my major from American history to film production (so I could check out cameras) and tried to make my videos tighter, more cinematic, and tailored towards the internet.

Eventually, I made a few sketches I liked, namely 'Wes Anderson Spider-Man' - which was the first video of ours to really branch out.

Randomly, producers from Jimmy Kimmel contacted me. I have no idea how Jimmy came across it, but he did. From that, I was able to snag an internship at the show, and see how things worked on a major television production. Near the end of my internship, I made another sketch - a parody of 'The Social Network' - which was coming out around that time. It was about the origins of Youtube. Jimmy tweeted it, and was incredibly supportive of what I was doing.

I graduated early, and then spent seven months or so living on couches and in open dorm rooms my friends had, trying to find work. Not much happening. Luckily, Jimmy and the producers there let me submit a writer's packet.

What happened during your first day working at Jimmy Kimmel's show?
I was 21 when I got the call that they liked my packet and I was getting the job. I was throwing out a box of pizza into a dumpster at the moment. The next week I was in a room with Jimmy Kimmel. And his writers. And it was my 22^nd birthday. And I felt like throwing up.

Truthfully though. I cannot think of another late night host who would take a chance like this: to blindly hire a writer whose experience consisted of Youtube sketches and a scant amount of Onion material. He single-handedly gave me a full-time career in television. He likes taking chances and trying new things, and that's what I think is going to make him a fixture of late night TV for a long time to come. He experiments. And I'll always be thankful for that.

There isn't much separation at the show. Writers write both monologue jokes and sketches. I like that style. It keeps you fresh. If the sketches aren't coming one day, just focus on the jokes. I didn't get a sketch on the show for a month or so. Which was a problem, but I was able to get monologue jokes on, and that kept me alive until my first sketch with Harrison Ford went on.  

What's an average workday like at the Kimmel show for you?
We get our topics in the morning, and we're also encouraged to find out own. We'll turn those in. Jimmy creates an outline - and we'll have additional rounds of jokes throughout the day. A large portion of our show revolves around clips or interactions with Hollywood Blvd pedestrians, so we work as a group on those.

If you get a bit approved, you're in charge of chugging that through towards the end with the field-producer and director. It's a huge relief to have them there, because I'm terrible at organizing field shoots... and I'd probably end up weeping in a bathroom somewhere.

When you write for a late night show, what's the attitude like towards the competition? Do you enjoy watching the others, aspire to beat them, or use them as a benchmark so as to say "Here's how our show is different from Conan, Fallon, etc."?
I think there's friendly competition with all the newer late night shows. We're looking forward to going up against Fallon when he takes the Tonight Show next year. It's an exciting time to work in late night, because now we're seeing a definite changing of the guard. And Jimmy's move to 11:35 earlier in the year was a major step towards that.

Personally, I think there's a ton to learn from all the shows. Colbert's comedy is surgical, precise, and scathing. Fallon's live-bits have amazing energy, and I'll always adore the slipshod absurdity of Conan sketches, especially those with Brian Stack (can you tell I love Brian Stack?) "The Interrupter" is probably my favorite recurring late night sketch of all time. They're perfect. I could watch them forever.

I think our show is more diverse than the others. One night, we'll have psychology experiments with people on Hollywood Blvd, the next we'll have a music video parody of "Blurred Lines," and then we'll make toddlers cry on Youtube. We've got a good mix, and Jimmy makes an excellent anchor for it all. I try to write him as your "Best friend from high school" - the guy you're comfortable hanging out with. His confidence shows on camera, and he's able to carry anything we throw at him.

Aside from adhering to standards, how is writing for TV sketches different from writing your own internet sketches?
Definitely a lot more hoops to go through. With internet sketches, I pretty much just had to convince my friends to make it, and then find someone willing to hold a boom pole for the weekend.

On television, obviously there are a lot more factors. I remember writing a sketch with William Shatner that had a short jab at a certain men's clothing store's late-return fees, and it was shut down, because that company was a sponsor. That makes absolute sense. They pay for us to be on the air. But it showed my obliviousness to the way things work.

I'll never exactly understand copyright and trademark infringement laws either. One time I made an internet sketch about Amtrak, and I received a strongly worded cease and desist Youtube message from their lawyers, demanding I take it down. You'd think Amtrak would have better things to do with their time.

But in general, I've tried to keep that "Youtube mentality" if you will, meaning that I have tried to write sketches the same way I would if I was still making Youtube sketches. Tried to keep the same voice... only now I get to play in a bigger sandbox.

There's definitely been a learning curve on set: I came from that Youtube world of all-night shoots, borrowing cameras from friends, and paying people with pizza. Things are much more regimented, unionized, and professional. Some of the on-the-fly Youtube experimentation might be gone, but it's a wonderful thing to be surrounded by professionals who absolutely know what they're doing. It helps me focus on just the writing. I don't have to worry about lighting, charging the battery, making sure Devin gets a ride home. It's freeing.

... but I do miss paying people in pizza.

When making your Youtube videos, how much thought did you put into your projects before you made them in terms of how popular they would be, or did you shoot things first and figure out how to promote them after the fact?
The internet can be a splintery place. It's hard to know what'll catch on and what will die without fanfare, but going into Wes Anderson, I knew that I could hit a certain Venn Diagram of the internet: cinephiles and comic book fans. It felt like a video I'd want to see, and a video I'd share with my friends, so I was hoping others would believe that too. I needed to hit the tenets of Wes Anderson: the tracking shots and the immaculate set design (as immaculate as a bunch of college juniors could toss together). My friend Kyle Helf did the camera work, and it still amazes me to this day what he pulled off with those limited resources. I also credit much of its success to Conrad Flynn, who has the finest Owen Wilson impression I've ever run across. He knocked it out of the park. His impression and insight in the production was key.

As far as internet exposure, I didn't really have blogger or media contacts, so casting a wide net was key. My friends and I would post it to as many forums, blog tip-lines, and link-dumps as possible, hoping someone would pick it up. Some eventually did, and it exploded from there. There's not really a strategy to it. Just find places that you think would post it, and send it to them. Reddit seems to be the nexus of viral videos nowadays, but that's an unpredictable place. It helps to cast a wide internet net.

I usually just make videos based on things I think were funny (Druid Snuggies, a dying war buddy asking far too much out of his friend, Superman learning what "Superman Dat Ho" really means and confronting Soulja Boy, Superman II style) - but every once in a while, you'll feel a pulse in your brain that tells you to move quickly on something. The Social Network parody was one of them. 

Internet comedy is like the Wild West, so you've got to be as quick and efficient as you can be, or your idea will be done by someone else. Overall, I don't advocate making videos just to get "internet popular". If that's the only reason you're making them, they won't hold up long. Absolutely make things you think can get exposure, but make sure they're founded on something. Go weird. Give yourself room to experiment. I made 40+ videos before I was happy with them. It takes a lot of time.I guess in short:  Work as hard as you can until you get lucky. Then keep working hard.

Several of your Kimmel sketches incorporate the guests: how does it come to pass that they participate? Do they make it known that they're game or does your team reach out to them? How soon ahead of time are they shot?
It's a mix. Michelle Obama's sketch was shot insanely fast- within an hour of her appearance if I remember correctly. It was right before the election, so her schedule was quite busy. She needed a quick, simple idea to promote voter turnout, so I pitched her blowing an airhorn to waker lazy voters up. It was blunt, surprising, and out of character for her. She was great. I couldn't see any other First Lady doing that...maybe Dolly Madison.

In many cases, their teams will reach out to us that they'd like to do comedy, and we'll pitch ideas accordingly.

I've always been fascinated by Harrison Ford's late night appearances, and his notoriously selective attitude towards how and when he discusses Star Wars. He has amazing focus, rage, intensity, and comedic timing - and we heard he was interested in doing comedy, so I thought I'd pitch an idea that gives a reason he's been hesitant to talk about Star Wars. That turned into this fun 2 part sketch where it's revealed he and Chewbacca had a falling out years ago.

Part one:

Part two:

Part One was my very first sketch on the show, and it probably saved me from being fired... so I'll be forever grateful.

I feel late night is very ephemeral and of the moment. It's meant to be something seen that day, and the shelf-life doesn't go much further than a few internet blogs the next week. But it was a lot of fun to tap into something with Harrison Ford, and carry that over into the next year when he appeared. It'd be great to make a trilogy of it... but we'll see.

The Ellen 'Nice-Off' was a fun opportunity to do a long-form sketch. Usually with late night bits, you start to sweat when it goes over 3 minutes, but I'm proud of how we were able to craft a narrative out of it. One of my favorite moments of being with the show was when Ellen dropped her nice facade for a moment and whispers into Jimmy's ear, breaking his soul completely. And Andy Fisher directed the pants off it; he deserves a boat of Emmys for all he does on the show.

Usually guests come to us, but occasionally we'll reach out to them. Right when we moved to 11:35, I pitched an idea for Will Ferrell to come on the show, not knowing that we had changed timeslots and being upset because it interfered with his existing reservation of the studio space. I believe I originally pitched Ferrell teaching a Bikram Yoga class in our studio, then Tony Barbieri, one of our veteran writers, pitched that it should be a QVC knife show. Tony and I wrote that together, and on the day of the show, Molly McNearney, our co-head writer pitched having Ryan Gosling come on as well. That was a fun sketch to write because it was a nice, three-headed team effort. I had the premise, Tony had the great (way better than Yoga) angle, and Molly put the Gosling cap on top of everything. That was a fun day to write for a late night show.

In that vein, who have been some of your favorite guests on the show?
Obviously, having Harrison Ford deliver words I wrote with the intensity and commitment that he did was an out-of-body experience. But there's a moment after his first appearance that always sticks with me.

 We had just finished shooting his altercation with Chewbacca. The crew was filing out, and I nervously approached him, and whimpered out a thank you for being in my first sketch on the show. He looked straight at me and said "You're pretty young, huh?" - I nodded. He said "But you got your foot in the door? Good. Keep getting your foot in the door and don't let these bastards get you down"--and then he LEFT. I had no idea where that came from, but I doubt I'll experience a cooler moment in my life.

Jason Schwartzman came on to shoot a quick appearance in our big Oscar Special sketch, which parodied blockbusters and terrible, overblown sequels: Movie the Movie 2V. I was overseeing it that year.

I have always loved Jason Schwartzman. Rushmore is one of those movies that I saw at exactly the right age, and it's my go-to choice when asked the impossible question of "What's your favorite movie?"

I pitched Schwartzman for the role of "Boy Robot Who Teaches His Family the True Meaning of Christmas" ... a bit selfishly, because I wanted to meet him. He agreed, and I went into the green room to explain the sketch to him, and he recognized me from the Wes Anderson sketch. I was floored. I made that three years ago with my friends.

My friend Seth played Spider-Man at children's parties on the weekend, and basically had to steal that costume so we could use it. We used a prop gun made out of duct tape. Our tracking shots were done with a wooden board on PVC pipes... and now Jason Schwartzman was talking to me in the green room about how much he and Wes loved it. I had to take a moment in the bathroom before shooting. That might have been the single most validating moment I've ever had. The internet gave that to me.

And by the way, he absolutely nailed the Magical Boy Robot Who Teaches His Family the True Meaning of Christmas, so it all worked out.

Another weird story I cherish involves Dean Cain. I adore Dean Cain. I only had two or three TV channels at home, so Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman was my absolute favorite show growing up. When I left the old childhood mountain town for college near LA, my friends would jokingly ask what celebrity I'd love to run into, and I'd unironically say Dean Cain. I truly wished to meet him. I consumed comic books growing up. I'm more of a Marvel guy, but it all boils down to Superman, right? He's Superman.

Four years of school went by, and I kid you not, during my last week of school, I was grabbing a sandwich at Subway, and in walks Dean Cain. I like to think I play it cool if I see celebrities in the wild... but not with him. I got a picture and I talked his ear off about how much I admired his portrayal Clark Kent, all while holding my Five Dollar Footlong Black Forest ham sandwich. I probably looked like a crazed fool.

A few years later, my girlfriend at the time called me in a weird tone. "I don't know how to tell you this... but... Dean Cain asked me out today."  Apparently he had seen her on TV (she's a reporter) ...made a few calls, and tried pursuing her. I was his biggest fan, and he betrayed me. It turned out to be a funny, weird story, but at the time, I felt crushed by irony. It's an odd feeling when Superman horns in on your girlfriend.

So this year, when Man of Steel came out, I pitched a sketch where nobody told Dean Cain there was a new Superman movie, which meant Jimmy had to break the news to him & break his heart. But on the day he agreed to do the sketch, I was in Hawaii officiating my best friend's wedding, so I never got to meet him and have an awkward "So... uh... did you ever ask a reporter out from TV?" moment. I envisioned us laughing about it, having a beer, and .... I dunno... being adopted as his son. It didn't happen. But all in all, I love Dean Cain. And this might be my favorite sketch on a personal level. It's weird, and I got to write something for the guy who instilled a sense of wonder in me as a kid.

Alan Alda is my white whale. I need to do a sketch with Alan Alda... if only to impress my dad who watches M*A*S*H reruns every day.

You wrote for last year's Emmys: what did you learn from that experience that you could use if you wrote for another awards ceremony in the future?
Jimmy was on a roll in 2012. He hosted the White House Correspondent's Dinner and hosted the Emmys. He was incredibly generous and allowed us all to come on as writers. That doesn't always happen. 

All this went down during my first full year n' a half at the show, so I was just wide-eyed during the whole process. Nothing about it sunk in. But if there's something I retained from it all, it's that outside criticisms don't matter. Those are two of the most picked-apart hosting gigs in the world. Intense pressure. But I was amazed with Jimmy's presence through it all. As a performer, he has a relaxed confidence I desperately wish I could emulate. Even if the pressure got to him, it didn't show. He nailed it. And he did it his way. He pranked his parents at the Emmys. How many people get to say they did that?

There's always so much buzz around these things, but it's just noise. I come from the world of Youtube comments, and I read every one. It makes me want to eat my own soul, but I do it. There's something admirable to being above all that. To staying focused and doing the show you want. Doing the work you want. It's a lesson I have not learned. I still read every Youtube comment.

So in short, I've learned nothing. But it was fun to write for both of those things. 

You didn't graduate from college that long ago but what do you see or hope for in the distant future for yourself? Would you like to act more?
I'd love to act more down the road. Stammering out three lines in an episode of The Office was one of the greatest thrills of my life. I'm appreciative that the folks at Kimmel allow me to occasionally slip into sketches here and there, usually playing a nervous Facebook user, Jedi, or generally nervous nerd person.

I'm happy where I am right now. I feel I've had more good fortune befall me than anyone I know, so I'd like to currently make the most of what I've been given. Down the road, it'd be great to write a nice satire or a pilot or a comic book or a M*A*S*H sequel but for now I'm focused on making the best late night sketches I can.

 How does it feel to be the 358th person interviewed for Zulkey.com?
... am I not the 336^th? I was promised that over G-Chat. Duped by Zulkey, again...